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The Science of God

The Science of God

List Price: $14.95
Your Price: $10.47
Product Info Reviews

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Rating: 4 stars
Summary: The Diference between faith and reason
Review: One of the most interesting facts of this book, in my experience, is people's reactions after reading it. Religous christians attack it for being unorthodox. Religous Jews tend to want to debate its points. Why?

Because Schroeder, a religous Jew, accepts the value of the many supportive texts that Jews read along with the bible. Christians reject these texts and look mainly to the texts obvious meaning. That is unfortunate.

Imagine, a 12th century Jewish comentator described the "big bang" in almost exactly the way a high school physiscs teacher would in 2001?. The writers of the talmud saw each stage of creation "evolving" into the next and discussed whether 6 days for the divine was the same as 6 days as they experience it. For me, such facts are mind blowing.

I urge anyone interested in understanding a Jewish approach to the world to read this text. We believe people were created with reason exactly so we could probe the mysterys of creation and help in the divine plan. Along with everything else, Schroeder demonstrates that much current science was prefigured by religous scholars who used holy texts as their source.

If you want to understand why faith and reason are not in conflict, I urge you to read this book.

Rating: 3 stars
Summary: The convergence of scientific and biblical wisdom?
Review: Gerald Schroder is both a man of science and an Orthodox Jew. The MIT educated scientist feel that he needs to be loyal to both the world of science and his orthodox Jewish faith.
His latest book is an attempt to demonstrate that there is no contradiction between these two seemingly contradictory worlds.
His first point is probably accepted by most people nowadays. The bible is not physics textbook neither can science answer our fundamental questions about life.
He then goes on to show weaknesses in the present theory of evolution.
Schroder is a man with a problem .He can neither forsake his religious faith or his scientific education. Therefore he must reconcile them. He uses Einstein's relativity to justify the biblical six days of creation and takes advantage of quantum mechanics to justify the Jewish philosophy from the middle ages of free will.
Schroder is part of a long tradition of over 1000 years that tries to live in the world of science and traditional religion .He finds himself in good company. But does it help?
I don't think his present volume will raise more than a smile from the committed non believing scientist or layman . His approach seems to be too selective. Schroeder's great awe at the workings of the universe proves nothing. The atheist simply accepts that that's the way it is. His work is based mostly on Jewish sources that may cause problems for the general reader.

In summary I don't think anyone will change his position due to this book. In the age we live in a better education in science is surely a prerequisite for all. However, we ignore ancient traditions at our peril and they are still part of our lives even if they can't fully explain the universe.

Rating: 3 stars
Summary: Great subject to attempt to tackle
Review: Not one of his best books. I thought the hidden face of God was much better for the money. Schroeder sympathizes with the intelligent design movement and makes a compelling case for his cause from a theological standpoint. For Schroeder, the mind can be converted into energy and energy can then be converted into mass. This is the next great step in physics and is just a few years before discovering the path for this venture. However there is much speculation and little evidence to back up the claims presented. The book is often lax on supportive evidence and testimony.

Schroeder believes physics will drastically change in the following years but his revolutionary view ends with that subject. Schroeder seems to blindly accept many other avenues without fail, such as geological dating, human evolution, and even embryology. Subjects which have much more subjective and questions marks. Further Schroeder's rational for doing so is not much more than simply accepting the status quo. His whole argument, for instance, against YEC and Noah's flood revolve around dated writing tablets. Schroeder argues the flood could not have altered dating schemes because certain writing pieces are dated at 10,000ys old. This is simply flawed reasoning and can be explain by skewed dates produced because of the flood.

There were several chapters were Schroeder went off topic and started going on some tirade. The chapter on free will was interesting but I expected more. His chapter on randomness and how mathematically evolution has many problems was very detailed. I thought that his take on Adam being the first human with a soul was an interesting way of interpreting genesis. A tough topic to cover, but Schroeder does ok.

Rating: 3 stars
Summary: Inspiring, but scientifically flawed
Review: Gerald Schroeder took upon himself a very ambitious (and important) mission: to unite the findings of modern science with the foundation of Biblical faith. This, by itself, is sufficient grounds to praise Schroeder's book.

Unfortunately, Schroeder did not do his "homework" in the areas of science outside his own area of expertise. And the result is a book full of factual inaccuracies and errors, which greatly damage the overall quality of the work.

The further Schroeder ventures from his own area of expertise (nuclear physics), the more mistakes he make: His discussion of free will and quantum mechanics (which is closely related to his work) is superb. Things get abit unpolished when he starts talking about Big Bang cosmology, and the chapters about biology and evolution are simply a farce. It is quite obvious that the author did not seek advice from the experts in the relevant fields, before writing his book...

Another problem with the book is its internal inconsistencies: For example, in one chapter Schroeder postulates that the dinosaurs appeared on Day 5, yet in another chapter he gives a timeline which clearly imples that the age of dinosaurs (210 to 65 million years ago) happened on Day 6. The only way to explain this embarassing contradiction is simple oversight: apperantly, the author forgot the first statement when he made the second... Not a good thing, in a book that trys to convey a well-thought world view.

So should you buy this book?

That depends on what your needs are. If you are looking for a new refreshing perspective on science and religion, than this book is for you. But if you want a book which gets the science right, you'll be far better off with the more standard popular science books (such as books by Timothy Ferris, John Gribbin and Stephen Hawking).

If you want a book which has both... then just wait a few years. After Schroeder has paved the way, it is only a matter of time until someone (perhaps even Schroeder himself) writes an appropriately researched book on the matter.

Rating: 4 stars
Summary: Amazing Concept. Not so good science...
Review: Modern scientific data points to a Universe billions of years old, while the Bible says that creation took six days.

Until recently, people assumed that they must choose between these two mutually exclusive options. A variaty of philosophies existed on both sides, but the bottom line was that only one of the two timeframes can be true.

Gerald Schroeder, in his amazing book, shows that both timelines can be genuinely and literaly true.

The idea is absolutely brilliant: Using the idea of relativistic time dilation, Schroeder proposes that the time scientists measure as billion of years was indeed precieved as six days from the Universal viewpoint.

After he is done with the six days of Genesis, he continues to tackle other difficult issues like free will vs. determinism, and the problem of evil. All in all, a very deep coverage of the usual questions typically asked by skeptics.

Now, for the critical part of my review:

While Schroeder excels in philosophy and theology, he makes quite a few grave mistakes when it comes to the science of his ideas.

The most important one is that his physical implementation of the six days of Genesis is totally at fault. This is even hinted in the book, as Schroeder correctly states the relation of universal time dilation to the background temperature. The dinosaurs would have to suffer the heat of billions of degrees, for their entire era to be compressed to one day. (In reality, the cosmological dilation associated with the age of dinosaurs is about 1%).

Normally, if I see such a mistake in a science book, I would throw it immediately into the trash. But in this case, the case Schroeder presents remains incredibly strong even after removing all the relativity calculations.

So strong, in fact, that I've only deducted one star from my rating because of it.

My recommendation:

Buy the book. Read it. And whenever Schroeder mentions time dilation calculations, ignore it. Don't let this major goof spoil an otherwise uplifting experience.

Rating: 1 stars
Summary: Science of the Goofed!
Review: The most charitable comment I can give to this book is that "it is a journey". More specifically, it is a torturing journey. The author tends to mix up very simple scientific methodology and metaphysical philosophy. Often, Gerald seems to look like an armchair philosopher and jumps to unsupported onotological conclusion. One may find plenty philosophical problems in the analysis, arguments from personal credulity and incredulity. The arguments are not even close to being convincing. I would not recommend this chauvinistic exegesis to anyone would like to 'find things out'.

Rating: 4 stars
Summary: Thinking outside the box,-- a seminal effort worth a read
Review: As a scientist in an ongoing search for truth, I have been disappointed by ham-handed efforts of the creation crowd to cling to extreme minority viewpoints of credentialed scientists from diverse fields of science that would collectively be required to support a *literal* interpretation of Genesis. Similarly, I have been mystified by scientists who reflexively dismiss the idea of some kind of intelligent design outright by way of circular reasoning, arguing that since intelligent design can never be disproven, it is not scientific and thus could not be truth, since only science can properly assess truth.

It is hard to understate, then, the moxie of Schroeder's innovative attempt to reconcile with Genesis scientifically DOMINANT paradigms (i.e. universe many billions of years old, terrestrial life hundreds of millions of years old, species variation to extensive degree by alteration or differential expression of genes). Schroeder introduces his intent thus: "In the following chapters, I attempt to avoid the subjective tendency of bending Bible to match science or science to match Bible." (softcover p.19) Whether he was successful or not is in the eye of the reader, but the explicit intent is refreshing.

This book, then, would be of particular interest to two groups:

1) Scientists who wonder how their mainstream conclusions could possibly be reconciled with ancient accounts of creation from the Hebrew Torah.

2) Jews and Christians who are discomforted by the apparent incompatability between the text of their faith versus the observed truth about our planet and universe as collected and interpreted by the VAST MAJORITY of professional scientists.

The prime example of this reconciliation is Schroeder's attempt to fit a 15-billion year old universe with the six-day account of Genesis by arguing that: 1) from a collective, "Creation-wide" perspective, time advanced differently in the primordial hot universe (time dilation), and 2) that "days" in the ancient hebrew text only adopted the terrestrial perception (instead of universal perception) of time passage upon the creation of man late in the "creation" process.

Later chapters address other issues, such as the likelihood that genetic variation by mutation at rates observed in today's laboratories (or even much greater rates) were sufficient to generate the speciation evidenced in the fossil record within the abbreviated time-frame indicated by the fossil record itself.

By virtue of his theological background and professional training (MIT-trained physicist), Schroeder is uniquely qualified to attempt such a reconciliation. However, as evidenced by several previous reviews, this training is not enough-- at least not enough to win over skeptical scientists. It may be that the sheer enormity of burgeoning data within each of the fields (molecular genetics, population genetics, paleontology, geology, as well as cosmology and particle physics) is simply too great for one individual to incorporate into solid perspective within *each and every* discipline to present an airtight case on all scientific fronts.

Previous reviewers have asserted gross inaccuracies with the science presented in this book. As a clinical neuroscientist, I am not in a position to assault or defend Schroeder on evolution, genetics, particle physics or cosmology. However, I would argue against throwing the baby out with the bathwater. For example, the latest data on cosmic background radiation indicates an accelerating expansion of the universe, and an approximate age of 13.7 billion years instead of the 15 Schroeder cites. Must this nullify the core of his whole premise? Maybe so, but not enough to discard this book out of hand.

The strength of this work is in its innovation. Schroeder rightly notes that the Bible is silent on many subjects, and actually leaves room for many observed phenomena, such as speciation and niche-filling by DNA alteration. It is only the rigid mindset of many religious individuals that closes this possibility.

The weaknesses of the book lie in the specific physical science undergirding Schroeder's arguments, as well as in his over-reliance on conjecture. I thus was left with the same mind-set I had before I read the book, namely that the simplest explanation for why the Genesis account is not borne out by the findings of mainstream science is that Genesis was inspired and spoke great *truth* on a metaphorical and didactic level-- but not at a literal level.

On the whole, I found it a fascinating read. In accord with previous reviewers, I liken this effort to a Model-T. Crude in the light of today, yet innovative at its introduction, with the potential to be honed with further investment in this line of reasoning. This whole line of inquiry would benefit enormously by some kind of COLLABORATIVE work, with each chapter penned by a bona-fide expert in that field of the physical sciences, where this expert can build a much more solid case in conjunction with the totality of data in his or her field. I could even envision anonymous contribution, inasmuch as publicly arguing for some kind of intelligent designer is probably not conducive to garnering tenure in the Paleontology Department of Secular State University....

Rating: 3 stars
Summary: What about Eve?
Review: While I started and finished the book convinced there is a God- so I certainly understand Schroeder zeal for the topic. Unfortunately, I took very little away from his book. To keep the review short I will mention a few pros and cons.

Pros-

1- The statistical analysis (While very tedious to read, and often very dull). Provides significant insight in to how "Life randomly occurring" doesn't quite add up.
2- the scientific evidence provided by the Big Bang shows that this theory of conception may not contradict the teachings of the Bible.
3- That seven days can actually be translated over many eons of time using Einstein's Theory of Relativity.
4- Evidence found in the entire fossil record doesn't fare well for those who beleive in Darwin's theorys on evolution.

Cons-
1- What about Eve? While Schroeder goes into great detail on how Adam may have been the first human with a "Soul" (meaning there may have been humans prior to Adam, but they were without a soul so they don't count) he completely neglects to mention Eve. Didn't God create Woman so that man wouldn't go through life alone? What about the concept of birth as being a punishment on women for Eve's sin? Did the "souless" pre-Adams not give birth? I point this out because it follows a disturbing trend of only pointing out the details that fit within the theory.
2- When talking in big numbers it can be very annoying when they are described as "a billion billion billions" or a "Billion Millions". Come on.... people who understand math (and you must understand math in order to learn ANYTHING from the book)hate this type of notation.

While I found the work to be fact filled I certainly didn't find it to be overly enlightening. Therefore, I have a hard time believing that non-beleievers would ever be convinced from any of his arguements.

Rating: 1 stars
Summary: read Karl Popper and Wittgenstein instead if not Sagan
Review: When people talk about God and Science, they make a lot of category mistakes. For a simple example, plenty people are very concern of arguments about proving or disproving the presence of God through observed facts. It is a simple mix-up of Formal and Informal System. A formal system is something like Mathematics, in which everything is well defined ahead of time before anything else is proven or disproven. 'Proving' or 'Disproving' is a concept from a formal system 'spilling' over to the Informal System. Language everyone uses is constrained by the fact that it is a tool used in an informal system, in which the constructs being used are forever changing in definitions. Terms, concepts, statements are all analytic. Talking about proving or disproving in such system is a misunderstanding of this demarcation and the features of metaphysics.

Why would people still spend time to write a book about this sort of things?

Karl Popper taught us how to build our epistemological structure. Wittgenstein taught us the fact that plenty philosophical problems are simply a misuse in language. Why do people still spend so much time in the inherent impossibility of linking metaphysical concepts to empirical sciences?

For a good introduction to scientific methodology, please read some Karl Popper. Platonic Ideas and Forms, Aristotle's Teleology, Freudianism, Hegalism, Marxism, etc etc, all made the same mistakes as what this book and plenty people on Earth are making. They all confuse justification with scientific reductionism. With a confused mind, they write books to confuse other people.

Rating: 5 stars
Summary: What if the world wasn't flat?
Review: Critics of this book remind me of those that insisted the world was flat. Or perhaps those that forced retractions to the then new "We travel around the Sun, proofs". Mathmatics is a wonderful thing, it attempts to show such things as infinity, limits, and non-real things. Physics uses math in the same way. Schroeder's book presents some real grasps (albeit faint ones with respect to the Eternal) on what no time looks like.

Our finite minds cannot understand the Mysteries of the Creator; however, we can see shadows, momentary events, finite happenings which suggest matter to be a real phenom, while at the same time realizing that there is an infinite amount of space between the smallest amount of observable distance. That is the essence of infinity.

This guy is a genius. He shows you a glimpse into the meaning of time and attempts to reconcile 6 days to 15 billion years. It's all relative and reasonable. I can't remember a book that was as revelatory, other than the bible. It absolutely mesmorized me and caused me to go sleepless thinking about what it presented. If you don't want to think too hard, don't buy this book. On the other hand, if you're searching for something that will absolute invoke a reaction, this is it.

Cons: Not enough discussion on the Natrual Log, it's definition, ramifications, usuages, etc. More math would be nice. In fact a whole book on the natural log would be perfect. There's something very mystical about the natural log.


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