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Summary: Anecdotes
Review: I am not a Catholic, and I had no ax to grind when I took up Rose's book, simply a curiosity spurred by the latest, well-publicized Church scandals. But how disappointing a book this is. Someone once said that the plural of anecdotes is not statistics, i.e., selected anecdotes don't make a case, and this book is, from beginning to end, entirely anecdotal, consisting of the recounting of unhappy experiences of disgruntled former seminarians. What they say may very well be true; I would bet that it is, but it should be clear to any reader that, depending on the seminarians Rose, or anyone else, chose, any case at all could be made. In my view, he has produced very weak evidence.
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Summary: Pure Junk
Review: What a holier than thou attitude.Do you like anyone?
Rating: 
Summary: Always is at least two points of view
Review: Whether you believe any thing in this book or not there is a huge chance you will walk away with a strenghtening in your true beliefs. I find this a very rewarding attribute in a book that attracts so much controversial critisism. This book leaves the bible where most agree, yet takes a gran turn on fundamentalism within the superstructure of Catholism. I am one of those who do agree that this turn is absolutely needed in the 21st Century. I highly recommend a new book which deals with this same subject matter in a much more realistic approach, SB 1 or God by Karl Maddox
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Summary: Questions Raised but not Settled
Review: In recent years a rising clamor of voices have argued that the dramatic decline in the number of men aspiring to the priesthood is evidence that the Catholic Church should ordain women, and married men. Michael Rose offers a valuable alternative to that view. In his very readable book, Goodbye, Good Men, Rose argues that the spirit of dissent in some seminaries has also contributed to the problem. Actually, Rose seems to argue at points that the rise of liberalism and dissent is *the* cause of the problem, and in doing so he overstates his case. His argument is built on interviews with "orthodox" priests and those who feel their vocations were derailed because they were too orthodox. There is enough detail in these cases for one to suspect that Rose has hit on something that is a problem But as a reviewer below notes, one should be reluctant to accept at face value the stories offered by individuals who clearly have an axe to grind (especially those who for some reason or another were not able to become priests). Rose's book offers no material from interviews with those who might disagree with his position. In some cases, it is not hard to read between the lines and realize that the facts presented are being presented in a contentious way. And since Rose offers no statistical analysis, the reader is left with no way to judge how important this phenomenon is. One can believe that a bias against orthodoxy has reduced the number of priests by some amount; it is much harder to believe that this is the entire explanation. Still, I think this book makes a contribution to our understanding of what is happening to the priesthood in America today. And it provides balance to the more liberal case that is most frequently aired in the press today. By all means read it. But I don't think it's the last word on the subject.
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Summary: Author fails to tackle the real reason for Church crisis
Review: Michael Rose prefers to believe that the abandonment of strict orthodoxy is the central reason behind today's crisis in the Roman Catholic Church. Everything supposedly would be wonderful in both the seminaries and the wider Church if only the Liberals had not acquired significant influence since Vatican II. A return to the traditional values, asserts the author, is the sure way to bring about bliss and organizational stability. Rose is half right, but it is where Rose is half wrong that should mostly concern us. After all, the arrest and conviction of the very high profile Our Sunday Visitor editor, Fr. Richard Ginder, for molesting altar boys occurred in the late 1960s. Fr. Ginder certainly was not a product of Liberal seminary training! The author regales us with alleged instances of Liberals making life hell on earth for their more conservative brethren. I see no reason to dispute him on the offered evidence, and for the sake of the argument will concede that Rose has his facts straight. Indeed, sociologist Fr. Andrew Greeley and other reputable scholars concur that homosexual priests set the agenda for much of the Catholic Church in the United States. Greeley, who is not an ideological comrade of Rose, even goes so far as to sarcastically describe these individuals as members of the "lavender mafia." Nonetheless, Rose fails to realize that the Catholic Church has few unchanging beliefs demanding the full assent of mind and will of its loyal adherents. The author conveniently ignores the fact that Catholicism has reversed itself on many matters throughout its long history. Why are its current teachings on human sexuality beyond question when the Church has renounced its original teachings on usury, the salvation of non-believers, political freedom, and the death penalty? There is little sense in attempting to reform the Catholic Church unless its members are willing to confront the awkward question: which teachings are truly infallible? When does somebody no longer have a right to call themselves a Catholic? Every viable organization must embrace a tradition and values that are beyond dispute. This is true whether it is a car manufacture, a non-profit charity, or even a football betting pool. Alas, Michael Rose does not adequately deal with this challenge. He is trying to place the cart before the horse. Should you therefore read "Goodbye, Good Men?" Yes, but one should do so only while ingesting a huge grain of salt.
Rating: 
Summary: Thank you, Michael Rose
Review: I was so angry when I read this book. Beacause it is so totally and tragically true. Anyone who says this book is not true has his head in the sand. Some bad guys went to the seminary. Some of them became priests and got on seminary faculties. Some of them became bishops. There is plenty of rot in the church these days. Michael Rose has told the truth. I know. I lived through it in the 70s. My seminary was not mentioned in the book, probably because it was too mediocre to be interesting. Lots of people ought to be required to read this book--and learn, before they do more harm.
I know several people in this book. I lived in detroit for five years. This book is plenty true enough.
o
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Summary: Take Back Our Church
Review: I read the book then read the reviews here. As a convert to Catholicism for over 14 years, I can only hope that publications like this will shine even more light on the evil that has penetrated our church. I find it interesting that those who wrote negative reviews about this book on this site are downgrading "conservative", "orthodox" thoughts and beliefs as "archaic". I guess, to them, all the news about sexual predator "priests" (they're not priests at all and they belong in prison) is false or overstated. No, it's now in our faces. With a problem as big as we have on our hands today in the Catholic church, it's obvious, even without this book that the predatory problem goes beyond being "born that way" as the liberals would want everyone to believe and therefore tolerate. For a problem as big as this (which makes us all look bad, not just the perverts that call themselves priests) had to be cultivated somewhere and Rose brings a direct light on this. To you liberals who call yourselves "Catholic"...sin is sin, evil is evil as it always has been and always will be. There's nothing "archaic" about that. Again, thanks to writers like Rose and the 99% of all Orthodox Catholics in the U.S. and the world, I am looking forward to the day when this evil (..."the gates of hell") will be not only exposed completely, but spewed out of the church, never to return. In a word, if you can't live with the laws and teachings of the Catholic church, then you are not a Catholic and you are free to go elsewhere to find justification for perversion and selfish pride.
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Summary: A must read for all who wonder why the Church has strayed
Review: Moral relativism infected our society and our seminaries. We now see the results. We see how the orthodox seminarians were systematically routed out as being too "rigid". We see seminaries in which pornography, sex outside of marriage and support of abortion were encouraged while studying the Fathers of the Church, showing respect for Pope John Paul II and saying the rosary were discouraged. Rose shows that there isn't a shortage of priests but rather a refusal to ordain those who believe in the moral teaching of the Church. The good news is that Orthodox seminaries are not having problems finding and ordaining good young men who are faithful to the teaching of the Catholic Church.
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Summary: The Truth Will Set You Free
Review: Yes, every Catholic should read this book. Why? It's all true. I experienced most of the horrors detailed in this book at a seminary located on the campus of the University of Notre Dame in the early 1980's. Devotion to the Church, the Eucharist, the Blessed Mother, etc were ridiculed even to the point of causing hurt. The faculty routinely lambasted the bishops as group of clerical know nothings. Yet, when they experienced a case of sexual impropriety among one of their own, who spent most of his priesthood railing against the heiarchy, they reacted in the same manner. They covered the situation up out of embarassment. Unfortunately and sadly, Notre Dame is something other than what most of you perceive.
What is most disturbing is that the problems, "the cancers", detailed in this book have spread from the seminaries to all levels of the church. They have reached our children in Catholic schools, where it has become nearly impossible to find a decent orthodox catechism.
If you decide to read this book, please read the last two chapters first, as they will offer you hope.
I pray that someone will give this book to Pope John Paul, God's good priest.
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Summary: Comparative books on Church's failure teaching sexuality
Review: I'm from Peoria, and if it plays in Peoria, it will--they say-- play anywhere, but something ain't playing in the rationale inside "Goodbye, Good Men." Michael Rosen's argument might ring true to people who were never in the locked-down, maximum-security of minor and major seminaries where an aggressive heterosexual culture of priests created a lifestyle way more abusive than sexual molestation. The militantly hetero priests, so preoccupied with chastity, taught really bad messages about sex, about women, and about how real men should behave--and this not-so-subtle gender-agenda amounted to real intellectual, psychological, physical, and spiritual abuse meant to "knock the corners off" boys, to "square them away," to make them obedient and skilled in keeping any scandal about the priesthood or the Church from ever leaking out. Rose's readers might balance his polemic by reading some of the newly emerging seminary literature written by former seminarians and priests whose picture of the Church, vocations, and women gives a more human face to the arguments Rose makes. One thinks of the memoir-novel "What They Did to the Kid: Confessions of an Altar Boy," written by a schoolmate of Bernard Cardinal Law, or "Escaping God's Closet" by Bernard Duncan Mayes. Because Rose on CNN was part of a conversation talking about the wonderful number of wholesome vocations coming out of Peoria, because of the Peoria diocese's traditional values, it is ironic that "What They Did to the Kid" actually takes place in Peoria and details how the Catholic Church recruited thousands of boys and then dumped them because they were not upper-middle-class enough, or masculine enough, or not smart enough--or, more often, too smart, too independent, too intellectual. Putting these three books together on my reading stand, I realize that the Church's current problem with sex is that sexuality has always been Rome's Achilles heel. Had the Church dealt with sexuality in all its facets from genetic homosexuality to reproductive rights to women priests, this would not today be a media scandal, fueled by, and I hope enlightened by the mix of the dozen good books out there that in their pages, inside their covers, do more for analyzing the Church's sexual problems, and conservative versus liberal agenda, than do most of the talking heads on television. Even with these dozen or so books about the seedbed of American seminaries and how they created a generation of accused priests, why are there not hundreds of books written by the million or so boys who from 1950 to 2000 were recruited to spend time in seminaries where anything could, and was, done to them? Ninety per cent of the boys recruited were turned back (most on their own--rescuing themselves) into the world. What did they know, or sense, and then have the good sense to know to leave, to escape, that the 10% who stayed for ordination did not, would not, could not deal with, and now stand on our altars? Give Michael Rose a read. But don't believe him only. Make a reading list.
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