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Sailing the Wine-Dark Sea : Why the Greeks Matter

Sailing the Wine-Dark Sea : Why the Greeks Matter

List Price: $25.95
Your Price: $17.13
Product Info Reviews

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Rating: 1 stars
Summary: Poor Effort
Review: I expected far more from the author of the other books in the "Hinges" series. I expected a synthesis of Greek contributions, thought and limitations but found it missing from the book. While the "How to . . ." structure interested me, the dialog slowly failed to go anywhere. The discussions mostly limited themselves to the Athenian portion of the Greek world and seemed to parrot the ideas of other Greek scholars, but in a manner less interesting than the original. The discussion on Greek art remided me of my own poor effort to describe the vast wealth in a college term paper.

I agree with his fundamental thesis that the Hellenic world was a cosmopolitan place with the full spectrum of human nobility and infamy, which continue to influence the world today. However, he failed to fully develop, discuss and prove his topics. For example in his concluding chapter, he gives us a five page long quotation from Thucydides: "History of the Pelopenesian War". This crutch of failed historians is unworthy of the author of "How the Irish Saved Civilization". He seemed in a hurry to cover the material and get to some other place.

I was most disappointed at his attacks on President Bush over the Iraqi War. Lack of a universal coalition does not make the removal of a mass murdering thug hubris! The author is entitled to his opinion about the virtues of the war, but a scholarly work on the importance of the Greeks to 3500 years of Western history limits the wonder the book might have shown us.

Read the primary sources or books by Michael Grant for a better discussion of this topic.

Rating: 3 stars
Summary: The Author Could Do a Lot better
Review: I first read Thomas Cahill's book "How The Irish Saved Civilization" and I was very disappointed. I was very impressed with the author's knowledge of Greek and Roman history but thought that the book was weak, and in fact most of the book supposedly on Ireland was about Greek writings, etc.

So when I heard about this book I was quite interested in the book, but due to my prior experience I looked at it first in a book store. I did not buy the book nor did I read more than 10% but I saw enough to see that the book was similar to the prior book that I read. He knows a lot of history and is well qualified but the books seemed to be done under some sort of time constraint or deadline and seem to lack depth. I would be really impressed if he could sit down and put together a proper book on the subject 600-800 pages long, and not have a series of short "gimmick" books.

My humble opinion.

Jack in Toronto

Rating: 2 stars
Summary: Couldn't get my teeth into this book.
Review: I found myself admiring the authors intellect but at the same time wondering why his readers would hang in there in such detail about Greek classical writing unless they were experts or had studied them.

I found, it wondered a lot and doubled back on the subject more than once.

The author's speech about his book was much more direct, entertaining, and interesting than the book. I'm sure all of this is in the book but I couldn't get myself interested enough to read it.

Rating: 2 stars
Summary: Greek 101
Review: I had the pleasure of meeting Mr. Cahill prior to his publication of the first "hinges of history" book, "How the Irish Saved Civilization." I found his premise for this series of books fascinating, and have read every book in the series. I was particularly looking foward to his book on the Greeks because: (1) it was somewhat of a departure for him in that it is a "pagan" civilization, unlike the books on the Hebrews, Jesus, and Saint Patrick he wrote from his theological background; and (2) having read most of the noted Greek works from Plato, Homer, Thuycidides, Herodotus, Aeschylus, Euripides, Sophocles, etc., I was interested to get Mr. Cahill's "take" on the importance of this civilization. Well, if you've read the Greeks, don't bother reading Cahill. He quotes liberally from these authors, without much new enlightment for those readers that have read the original works. This would be an okay introductory text for people that have not read the original works. But, even then, it's not all that illuminating. There was a fascination with Greek erotica that did not elevate the tone of the discussion. Nor was his footnote comparing the Peloponnesian War with the Iraq War of Bush & Rumsfeld appropriate in a book that does not wish to date itself for future readers outside our era. Guess Mr. Cahill suspected this book will have a short shelf-life. If you wish to read a more penetrating, poignant, and insightful study of the Greek civilzation, I recommend the hard-to-find Edith Hamilton books, "The Greek Way," and, especially, "Echo of Greece."

Rating: 2 stars
Summary: Greek 101
Review: I had the pleasure of meeting Mr. Cahill prior to his publication of the first "hinges of history" book, "How the Irish Saved Civilization." I found his premise for this series of books fascinating, and have read every book in the series. I was particularly looking foward to his book on the Greeks because: (1) it was somewhat of a departure for him in that it is a "pagan" civilization, unlike the books on the Hebrews, Jesus, and Saint Patrick he wrote from his theological background; and (2) having read most of the noted Greek works from Plato, Homer, Thuycidides, Herodotus, Aeschylus, Euripides, Sophocles, etc., I was interested to get Mr. Cahill's "take" on the importance of this civilization. Well, if you've read the Greeks, don't bother reading Cahill. He quotes liberally from these authors, without much new enlightment for those readers that have read the original works. This would be an okay introductory text for people that have not read the original works. But, even then, it's not all that illuminating. There was a fascination with Greek erotica that did not elevate the tone of the discussion. Nor was his footnote comparing the Peloponnesian War with the Iraq War of Bush & Rumsfeld appropriate in a book that does not wish to date itself for future readers outside our era. Guess Mr. Cahill suspected this book will have a short shelf-life. If you wish to read a more penetrating, poignant, and insightful study of the Greek civilzation, I recommend the hard-to-find Edith Hamilton books, "The Greek Way," and, especially, "Echo of Greece."

Rating: 4 stars
Summary: Another "Hinge of HIstory"
Review: I suspect I would have liked this book better if I had not had Cahill's other "Hinges of History" books to compare it to. Of the four- How the Irish Saved Civilization, The Gifts of the Jews, and Desire of the Everlasting Hills are the others- this was the least engaging to me. Taken by itself, I enjoyed Cahill's insight and irreverent humor as he traced the rise and fall of the Greeks from the Minoans through Alexander the Great. Using historical people or literary figures he shows us the development of the civilization in How to Fight, Feel, Party, Rule, Think and See from the perspectives of the Greeks. He acknowledges their limitations and their massive and amazing contributions. It was also interesting to read the first few pages about his approach to history and the last pages linking Greeks to other groups he has described. I look forward to the other books he has planned and this is well worth reading. Unfortunately for the author, (in my opinion) he is competing with his own earlier books and, as good as this is, it is not as good as the earlier three.

Rating: 3 stars
Summary: A Spotty Book
Review: I walked into Cahill's classroom when "How The Irish Saved Civilization" was wowing the Academic community. And I must say I was impressed by the lecture. It confirmed some suspicions I had about fifth/sixth century cultural communications betwen East and West. I guess I was ready for it like a well read graduate student in a serious seminar.
Wine Dark Seas is no such classroom (as some other reviewers point out there are factual errors as well as errors of taste.) Yet, despite these flaws, and they are flaws, this book, I think, best compares to the trendy professor teaching a Humanities One course. Forget the "Hinges of History " title, this is not HISTORY. It might serve as a quick refresher to the traditional liberal arts majors, but its main purpose is a general education elective for bus/ag/ed/engineering majors, not graduate level, or even advanced undergrad Classics or History majors.
Every teacher of Art/Lit/Classics has been asked at one time, "Why do we have to read this junk?" And we answer, "Because it matters." Cahill shows "why the Greeks mattered" and continue to do so. In seven core chapters and with illustrations the book details the Greeks shaping influence on warfare, poetics, society, politics, philosophy, aesthetics and theology. These terms themselves illustrate the point. For his chapter titles, Cahill popularizes : "How to fight." "How to feel." etc. The book never bogs down in the abtruse potentially lurking in this topic. The pronouncing glossary of names and a chronology are helpful and for the vast majority, the Greek Alphabet is a practical necessity. And while allowing for the breezy vulgarity, I would be happy if this book rather than some video games would occupy some of my son's hours.


Rating: 2 stars
Summary: Falls short in all areas except sexuality
Review: I wanted this to be a great read, unfortunately it was not. The author spent more time on Greek sexuality, specifically homosexuality, than on any other topic. Every chapter, whether it dealt with Philosophy, Art or War, spent an inordinate amount of time delving into Greek eroticism. In the end I felt that Cahill delighted in using foul language and crass terms for shock value -- they added nothing and certainly became more than annoying towards the end. Cahill opens and closes the book by talking about America and North Korea -- dating the material and making me wonder how serious he was when he wrote it.

Thankfully it was a quick read and not too much of my time was lost. I suggest you pass on this book and look for another. You won't learn anything interesting here, unless you want to know more about the sexual habits in ancient Greece.

Rating: 5 stars
Summary: Putting it all together
Review: I was surprised by the relatively cool evaluations of this book! I have a bushel of fragments about Greek civilization beginning with Durant's Life of Greece in the eighth grade, but Cahill has sorted my fragments into a coherent mosaic which also brings it into the perspective of contemporary life. How many references I have in my "bushel" to Pericles's Funeral Oration, but why had I never read it complete, and freshly translated? Thank you, Mr. Cahill!

Rating: 2 stars
Summary: Disappointing, offensive, annoying.
Review: Mr. Cahill is an accomplished, erudite, sophisticated academic with a gift for simplifying the complexities of ancient civilizations and, thereby, making them accessible to the casual modern reader. Sadly, in Sailing the Wine-Dark Seas, he has allowed his obvious preoccupation with base erotica (often stooping to vulgar phrases that most who are reading this text would not use in discourse with close friends)to obscure the assumed goal of enlightening the masses. Athough clearly more than adequately conversant with the culture under discussion, Cahill provides the reader with only the most superficial analysis and precious little original thought. In addition, Mr. Cahill's anti-Bush political beliefs are permitted to intrude into the narrative, serving only to demean his scholarship and date his work. A very disappointing offering in what is otherwise an excellent series.


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